Electro? Electro-Funk?

  • Wex, i am gonna break my commitment to not talk about this with you anymore, and say it one last time. This is not about what style is what, and why they sound the way they do, it is about the term ( word ) Electro, and how it relates to the issue we have in the Electro Bass and Electro Funk scene with people not liking other genres like Electro House, and Electro Disco calling it that, or Electro for short.


    People in our scene are hell bent on claiming the term Electro as their own, and it is not gonna work for one simple reason: The term has been used for ages to define Electronic music as a whole in other circles, meaning that anything Electronic can be called Electro. Am i saying call Trance, DnB, or Techno Electro Trance or Electro DnB? No! But when someone says they make Electro, and it is not Electro Funk or Bass, dont say it isnt Electro because essentially, historically speaking, it is.


    The word Electro did not come from the word Electro Funk, it was there before...Electronic music did not start with Kraftwerk, it was there way before. People need to understand this.


    If our music is to survive and grow, then its members and contributors need to emphasize the style of Electro we do, so that it stands out from the rest. This forum is mainly about Electro Funk and Electro Bass...that is what we need to call it. Calling it just Electro is like saying we simply do music....how is anyone supposed to know that it is any different than anything else if you dont define what it is by style?

  • Quote from Cozmo D;64926

    Well, by the definition that you used Kraftwerk made very little Electro, and didn't make ANY until "Numbers". So we can't very well say that they are an Electro group, can we? BTW, I gather that you don't consider Yellow Magic Orchestra Electro either, because by your chronology they beat Kraftwerk by a good 3 years. Shit, I wrote "Computer Age" in 1981, maybe I invented Electro! :D

    TEE was it 77, "Numbers" is just for more characteristic example: "its syncopated rhythm is fundamentally built on the base model "kick-snare-kick-kick-snare-kick" whose typical example is the piece of Kraftwerk's "Numbers'''.



    Quote from Cozmo D;64926

    I didn't call YOU stupid, I called the definitions that you copied and pasted stupid. You didn't write them, did you? ???

    I'm understood, and I'm asked you to write not stupid characteristic of disco and electro.

  • Quote from wex;64939

    "its syncopated rhythm is fundamentally built on the base model "kick-snare-kick-kick-snare-kick" whose typical example is the piece of Kraftwerk's "Numbers'''.


    This is the most insane part of that Wikipedia article ... I thought that electro article was misguided in a lot of ways; I think there is even a thread about it where it is discussed.


    Edit: Found it: https://forum.electroempire.com/forum/showthread.php?t=7652


    And Starchild: When I am speaking of "Electro" in this thread, I am of course using it as a short form of "electro funk" ... but I would agree with you that we should rather speak of electro funk to avoid confusion.

  • That Wikipedia article is awful.
    If you need Wiki to tell you what electro is...you might as well give up now.
    By the definition written there...most classic electro tracks are not electro.


    BTW...all electronic music is not called Electro...i never heard anything else use that title apart from the Electro we all love..and now Electro house.

  • Quote from Starchild;64936

    This is not about what style is what, and why they sound the way they do, it is about the term ( word ) Electro, and how it relates to the issue we have in the Electro Bass and Electro Funk scene with people not liking other genres like Electro House, and Electro Disco calling it that, or Electro for short.

    Yep, because it's right. ;) Electro it's a umbrella term for all substyles of our breakbeat electro, it's only it may have this name.


    Quote from Starchild;64936

    People in our scene are hell bent on claiming the term Electro as their own, and it is not gonna work for one simple reason: The term has been used for ages to define Electronic music as a whole in other circles, meaning that anything Electronic can be called Electro.

    it's never be, probably it's only at your mind.


    Quote from Starchild;64936

    Am i saying call Trance, DnB, or Techno Electro Trance or Electro DnB? No! But when someone says they make Electro, and it is not Electro Funk or Bass, dont say it isnt Electro because essentially, historically speaking, it is.

    But it turns out that you implies this, so your point of view also will not work. And confusion started with electroclash, and continue with electro house, cause electro community lazy to educate, spread word of electro in the masses ;) Missed the point... But now when electro rising a little, we will be able to fix situation, of cause if we need it.


    Quote from Starchild;64936

    The word Electro did not come from the word Electro Funk, it was there before...Electronic music did not start with Kraftwerk, it was there way before. People need to understand this..

    EM always was marked as electronic, not electro. And Electro as name of our style still come from the word Electro Funk.


    Quote from Starchild;64936

    If our music is to survive and grow, then its members and contributors need to emphasize the style of Electro we do, so that it stands out from the rest. This forum is mainly about Electro Funk and Electro Bass...that is what we need to call it. Calling it just Electro is like saying we simply do music....how is anyone supposed to know that it is any different than anything else if you dont define what it is by style?

    Also we have not only Electro Funk or Bass, as well as IDM, techno etc, so you multiple wrong ;D

  • Quote from DJR21;64941

    That Wikipedia article is awful.
    If you need Wiki to tell you what electro is...you might as well give up now.
    By the definition written there...most classic electro tracks are not electro.

    Write better, how you can see it. With what exactly you do not agree? You wrote it:


    Quote

    ;)

  • Wex,
    I did not disagree that the numbers beat is heavily used.
    I disagree with the fact that if a song does not use that particuar beat, vocoders etc then it is not electro.
    That is what you and your friend Wiki are saying right ?


    Anyway, we are always going to have different opinions, at least mine are from experience and not a dodgy web site.

  • Quote from wex;64890

    Absolutely :) Every style his own borders and specifics. For example: wheh Juan Atkins remove break from his music, it became techno, or KW don't use that specific rhythm pattern it's just synthy.



    Man Machine ?
    Music Non Stop ? (808 drum machine btw)
    Its more fun to compute ?
    Not electro ?

  • Quote from wex;64939

    TEE was it 77


    Oh, so TEE IS Electro now? You guys need to come to some kind of consensus! :D



    Quote from wex;64939

    "Numbers" is just for more characteristic example: "its syncopated rhythm is fundamentally built on the base model "kick-snare-kick-kick-snare-kick" whose typical example is the piece of Kraftwerk's "Numbers'''.


    Ridiculous! To say that an entire genre of music is based on one simple 1 bar drum pattern is utterly stupid (yes, I said it again). And what is more, THE DAMM THING EVEN HAS THE BEAT WRONG!. "Numbers" is a 2 bar pattern that goes "Kick-snare-kick-snare-kick-snare-kick-kick-snare. ;)



    Quote from wex;64939

    I'm understood, and I'm asked you to write not stupid characteristic of disco and electro.


    I didn't characterize Disco and Electro as stupid, I characterized the articles that you cut and pasted as stupid. And they ARE! Seriously, any dimwit can contribute to a wiki article, which is obviously what has happened in those 2 cases.

  • Quote from DJR21;64946

    Wex,
    I did not disagree that the numbers beat is heavily used.
    I disagree with the fact that if a song does not use that particuar beat, vocoders etc then it is not electro. That is what you and your friend Wiki are saying right ?

    But confirm that electro formula is "boom tchack". About vocoder - it's just typical electro thing, but not mandatory. Are TEE and Numbers so different?


    Quote from DJR21;64946

    Anyway, we are always going to have different opinions, at least mine are from experience and not a dodgy web site.

    So describe you experience.

  • Quote from DJR21;64947

    Man Machine ?
    Music Non Stop ? (808 drum machine btw)
    Its more fun to compute ?
    Not electro ?

    Why not ??? You understand that these tracks electro, so am i, enough to listening, so what's different between our point?

  • Quote from wex;64951

    Are TEE and Numbers so different?


    EXTREMELY!!! They are completely different! And as far as I am concerned they are both Electro (but what do I know?). That's why it is ridiculous to claim that Electro is built around the "Numbers" beat, or any other single beat for that matter. :)

  • Quote from Cozmo D;64950

    Oh, so TEE IS Electro now? You guys need to come to some kind of consensus! :D

    When i say that isn't ???


    Quote from Cozmo D;64950

    Ridiculous! To say that an entire genre of music is based on one simple 1 bar drum pattern is utterly stupid (yes, I said it again). And what is more, THE DAMM THING EVEN HAS THE BEAT WRONG!. "Numbers" is a 2 bar pattern that goes "Kick-snare-kick-snare-kick-snare-kick-kick-snare. ;)

    Not one pattern, this is basis around which build all possible interpretation. "kick-snare-kick-kick-snare-kick" - it's a formula of electro break! or I'm wrong and this formula isn't consist in every electro track? What the different between funk rhythm puttern and electro, or they are the same for you?


    Quote from Cozmo D;64950

    I didn't characterize Disco and Electro as stupid, I characterized the articles that you cut and pasted as stupid. And they ARE! Seriously, any dimwit can contribute to a wiki article, which is obviously what has happened in those 2 cases.

    OMG ;D I uderstood you. Please again, write here right/correct defenition of electro and disco!

  • Quote from binalog;64938

    That is not true. Electro DID come from the word 'Electrofunk'. We cannot change history... ;)


    Evan, the word was used a lot in the 70s...it did not come from Electro Funk. To people that follow Streetsounds and 80s Electro Funk maybe, but the word existed before that.


    I have always felt that it came from the fact that Electronic music was introduced as Electro-Acoustic, and even the Moog was first considered an Electro Acoustic instrument.


    Read back through the thread, and you will even find an extensive discussion on this subject, and even an article that Matt posted from the 70s that talks about this.


    Does anyone else feel like this is trying to teach pigs how to sing?



    Not calling any of you pigs...just sayin' :-/

  • Quote from wex;64954

    When i say that isn't ???


    Matt said that it started with "Numbers". I still say that it started in the '60s. :)


    Quote from wex;64954

    Not one pattern, this is basis around which build all possible interpretation. What the different between funk rhythm puttern and electro, or they are the same for you?


    They CAN be the same, but I believe that even "Firecracker" (released here in the states as "Computer Games") is Electro and that has a half Disco beat. But like I have said all along, it's a European term, not an American one, so my say don't count for much.


    Quote from wex;64954

    OMG ;D I uderstood you. Please again, write here right/correct defenition of electro and disco!


    Electro: Electronic dance music with a Funk beat rhythm with an emphasis on synthetic sounds.


    Disco: Dance music based on a quarter beat kick drum rhythm, usually defined by the era in which it was created ('70s).

  • Quote from binalog;64938

    That is not true. Electro DID come from the word 'Electrofunk'. We cannot change history... ;)


    Too right, the singing pigs here though will never agree :D

    ELECTROFUNK is a subsidiary of HIP HOP MUSIC AND CULTURE, don't you forget it suckaz...

  • Quote from Cozmo D;64957

    Electro: Electronic dance music with a Funk beat rhythm with an emphasis on synthetic sounds.


    Disco: Dance music based on a quarter beat kick drum rhythm, usually defined by the era in which it was created ('70s).

    ;D It is about nothing, too general. And probably you don't hear about nu disco hype? :)


    So house will be: Dance music based on a quarter beat kick drum rhythm, usually defined by the era in which it was created ('80s-90s-00s-10s)? :)

  • Quote from Cozmo D;64957

    Matt said that it started with "Numbers". I still say that it started in the '60s. :)


    I was speaking about the "formula" though. If you define "Electro" by a few elements in such a narrow formula, then "Numbers" will be the earliest stop. Of course there will always be something that came before that...... and we all know it started in Afrika. :D


    Anyway, i think there will never be a consensus over all of this, its just too much of a mess. :ugly:

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